January 15, 2011
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Musings Of A Terran Player
With StarCraft 2 being out for several months already, and two patches that have smacked the space marine faction of StarCraft, the Terrans, I still hear complaints about the race. I’m not here to disagree with the nerfs that have already been done to the Terrans, rather I’m here to defend the use of an essential tactic that’s quite key to Terran play. Everyone I know that plays complains rather loudly about M&M, no not the candy, but the use of Marines and Marauders by Terran players of all levels. These people will say that it’s too cheap, and things like it’s far too easy to use. What they don’t realize is that for most occasions it’s the best and most viable option to be using.
Marines and Marauders is realistically the only choice for an early game Terran to deal with most threats in the early game. It is still tactically viable in the mid-game which is a blessing for Terran players. With tanks already being nerfed, reapers being practically non-existent in the current patch, and the lack of a good anti-air air unit, Terrans need to rely on their deadly remix of the famous candy. Addressing the anti air comment, vikings tend to get overwhelmed against mutalisks but do well against bigger air units, which the majority of online Zerg players will use at one point and time. What you’re left with is marines that you HAVE to stim to chase pesky mutalisks away, knowing they’ll come back to harass your mineral line at any time. You then have to throw resources into placing missile turrets around your base just to keep it safe from that constant threat. Terran infantry is essential for the Terran player to win.
Although an early mechanized build is viable against Zerg and arguably better , and ravens are extremely effective against Zerg air in the late game, the hard part is getting to the late game. These strategies aren’t really viable against the enigmatic Protoss. Applying pressure to a Protoss player is ALWAYS good idea, and there’s no better way to do that than with M&M and with the inclusion of ghosts your bioball becomes a scalpel designed to wipe out the Protoss threat. There’s no real other choice for terran players in the mid and early game against a Protoss. Build mech early? Get ready to get stomped by zealots and stalkers with charge and blink. Air early? Stalkers with blink and photon cannons are enough of a deterrent to rethink this. Don’t get me wrong, air can still work for harassment on a good Protoss, and a mech build with thors and tanks will break through eventually. A good Terran player against a Protoss will evolve his build order from infantry to whatever he needs afterwards to wipe out all vile alien scum.
Don’t get me wrong, there’s still plenty of viable strategies when dealing with the two alien races for our humble race, but the use of infantry and its advantages cannot be overlooked. Nor are they ‘cheap’ or broken’. Terran infantry is the only realistic way to deal with alot of threats that the other races throw at us. they are essential to enforcing our presence in the Koprulu sector . Lastly this is written for higher tier play, and obviously assuming both players are scouting and diligent enough to get a sense of whats going on.
Musings of a Terran Player
By Danny Luong
With StarCraft 2 being out for several months already, and two patches that have smacked the
space marine faction of StarCraft, the Terrans, I still hear complaints about the race. I’m not here to
disagree with the nerfs that have already been done to the Terrans, rather I’m here to defend the use of
an essential tactic that’s quite key to Terran play. Everyone I know that plays complains rather loudly
about M&M, no not the candy, but the use of Marines and Marauders by Terran players of all levels.
These people will say that it’s too cheap, and things like it’s far too easy to use. What they don’t realize is
that for most occasions it’s the best and most viable option to be using
Marines and Marauders is realistically the only choice for an early game Terran to deal with most
threats in the early game. It is still tactically viable in the mid-game which is a blessing for Terran players.
With tanks already being nerfed, reapers being practically non-existent in the current patch, and the lack
of a good anti-air air unit, Terrans need to rely on their deadly remix of the famous candy. Addressing
the anti air comment, vikings tend to get overwhelmed against mutalisks but do well against bigger air
units, which the majority of online Zerg players will use at one point and time. What you’re left with is
marines that you HAVE to stim to chase pesky mutalisks away, knowing they’ll come back to harass your
mineral line at any time. You then have to throw resources into placing missile turrets around your base
just to keep it safe from that constant threat. Terran infantry is essential for the Terran player to win.
Although an early mechanized build is viable against Zerg and arguably better , and ravens are extremely
effective against Zerg air in the late game, the hard part is getting to the late game. These strategies
aren’t really viable against the enigmatic Protoss. Applying pressure to a Protoss player is ALWAYS good
idea, and there’s no better way to do that than with M&M and with the inclusion of ghosts your bioball
becomes a scalpel designed to wipe out the Protoss threat. There’s no real other choice for terran
players in the mid and early game against a Protoss. Build mech early? Get ready to get stomped by
zealots and stalkers with charge and blink. Air early? Stalkers with blink and photon cannons are enough
of a deterrent to rethink this. Don’t get me wrong, air can still work for harassment on a good Protoss,
and a mech build with thors and tanks will break through eventually. A good Terran player against a
Protoss will evolve his build order from infantry to whatever he needs afterwards to wipe out all vile
alien scum.
Don’t get me wrong, there’s still plenty of viable strategies when dealing with the two alien races for our
humble race, but the use of infantry and its advantages cannot be overlooked. Nor are they ‘cheap’ or
broken’. Terran infantry is the only realistic way to deal with alot of threats that the other races throw
at us. they are essential to enforcing our presence in the Koprulu sector . Lastly this is written for higher
tier play, and obviously assuming both players are scouting and diligent enough to get a sense of whats
going on.
To contact the author of this post: danny.luong@wildgunmen.com
Check out http://www.youtube.com/huskystarcraft
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It’s actually completely ridiculous how people complain about M&M, it’s pretty much all Terran has. Ask any pro-gamer out there, past early game where M&M is actually useful, terran has no other alternatives and no late game.
Terran mech seems pretty good, but the thing is, it takes forever to build up an army, extremely weak towards air and is slow and immobile. The reason why mech is so weak towards air is because thors are supposed to be a hard counter to mutalisks and voids, but because of the exploit magic box, a thor gets completely decimated by mutas since it cannot do aoe damage.
Terran air is complete garbage. Banshees are expensive and good for early harass but once early game passes, the opposing player gets antiair/turrets, banshees become pretty much worthless. The inability to attack air just completely cripples them. A zerg player can just build a few mutalisks, destroy your expensive banshees and then proceed to raid your economy much more efficently. Some may say that vikings are a counter to this yet unknown to many, mutas actually are a soft counter to vikings, not the other way around, and 1 void ray can take out 2 vikings. Then lastly we have battlecruisers. Expensive, slow, tiny range and loses cost for cost to almost anything in the game.
So now, theres just the terran bioball left. Sure its strong and has lots of dps but there should be absolutely no reason why either zerg or protoss complain about it. Honestly, theres so many counters to terran bio its not even funny. Let’s start with zerg, they make a couple banelings and our bioball is just gone. Mid-late game, a single fungal growth will almost kill every single marine in the ball and fungal has a pretty big aoe. Now protoss. Protoss has the single most broken unit in the whole game. High templars. Honestly, as a terran player when I see a high templar, I almost want to quit right then, right there. It takes out pretty much every single marine in your ball and damages your maurauders to less than half health. Colossus also tear apart the marine ball. There should be absolutely no reason at all why people think bioball is overpowered.
I can’t disagree with necessity of m&m. I do however disagree with its timing strength. I can’t speak for a zerg player, but as a religious toss player I realize how completely unmanageable it can be for the first 14 to 15 minutes. Ive tried a lot of build to hard counter in the first 15 minutes – and it’s impossible playing against a good player. No tier 1 units stand a chance against concussive shell. Marauders out damage and cost about a third less then stalkers. With concussive and stim, they are the best kiting units in game. Zealots are effective, if the terran bile ball stays in one place and doesn’t micro. If not concussive and/or stim rips them apart. Sentries help, but only at choke points, or with at least 4 sentries (200min/400 gas/8 supply) to split the army. I agree, late game against nothing but mmm, i will generally rip an even economy terran apart. storm or colossi. but these are tier three units, and high templars take as long as battle cruisers to start producing, and require upgrades before you can even storm. By this time, if the terran player is smart enough to see that im attempting to turtle and tech, his medivacs are all up in my shit. Immortals do well against just marauders. Colossi do well against just marines. but marines eat immortals alive and if marauders focus fire a colossi it takes it down in about 8 hits, upgrade dependent.
MMM is necessary, But it does need a nerf, primarily to marauders. They’re either too cost effective or do too much damage. Not both, just one or the other needs a nerf.
Also, i’m not saying terran is better as a race. Just the slant of early to late game play is heavily favoring the former. Toss may have superiority late game, but the late game is not guaranteed, the early game is.
Terran needs a late game buff, but an early game nerf, and I know quite a few diamond rank terran/random players who agree.
What exactly….. is hard to counter as toss? As a player who sometimes plays random, I am quite good at protoss and i find that terran is ridiculously easy to beat.
The thing with toss is that they will literally win, no matter what they do unless you don’t scout and you just happen to do what gets hard-countered by them. For example, if you don’t scout and try to FE against a 3 rax push then you’re most likely going to be behind/lose. However if you do scout then it should be very very simple to win. I mean.. blizz even made a special cloaked detector for toss in the form of an observer, you should always know what your opponent is doing and before you get robo you should check with probes.
Here are your options as toss if you scout.
1. You see 3 rax, run back to your base build a sentry and /lol as you split their army and tear it to shreds as they try to run up your ramp.
2. You see 2 gas/they going 1-1-1, you /lol and go your standard 2 gate robo build, get an observer and destroy their expensive banshees with your stalkers.
3. You see a 1 rax FE, /lol 4 gate and overwhelm him easily.
4. You see them do anything, /lol and build dts. Terrans can’t do shit against dts if you split them up so they waste their scans on 1
1. this will only work if the terran is inexperienced enough to just throw his army at you. he keeps you contained while he macros a little better and just throws medivacs at you
2. if you don’t continue into immortals or colossi you just built yourself a 450 resource scout. colossi do well, but like i said before… TIER 3 and they can be ff’ed down.
3. viable. and this is the only one that makes any /lol sense. the rest is you haven’t won or you’re playing against an amateur.
4. the most common (and imo the best) unit comp terran is using atm is banshee raven marines medivacs. dts take as long as ravens and are a far bigger all in.
you agree that m&m is all terran has. yet you hit on their weak points. did i say that toss doesn’t have an advantage late game? or key units that can make or break games? i don’t see that anywhere. im not saying toss is bad. im saying marauders are too good. grab a calculator, take the damage per second per resource unit a marauders does and weight it with the production time, then add a unnumbered variable note for stim and concussive shell for kiting ability, then compare it to any other tier 1 unit in the game, besides mass lings.
2 stalkers + 3 zealots = 4 rines + 4 marauders. toss cycle is quicker but the 8 unit bile ball will 1 shot a zealot. once the zealots are dead the stalkers get ripped apart. ive run the demo in different multiples playing both races, and, guess what, terran wins every time with mild micro kiting away from stalkers.
1. I don’t really understand… being \contained\ by a terran bioball is actually pretty funny, you just sit back, relax and build colossus/immortals to break it.
2. The most standard toss build is 2 gate robo into immortal/colossus… why would you even bring up not building them? A colossus is a walking death star for fucks sake.
3. Yes
4. Terrans aren’t going to blindly build ravens, DT’s are so much faster than Ravens as well, and is not at all an all-in, your dt rush fails, build some high templars and /lol their bioball
I’m saying M&M is all Terran has and agreeing with the article that toss and zerg should definately not be QQing about it since in reality they aren’t nearly as strong as some people seem to think.
Maurauders and Marines get torn up by chargelots and blink stalkers, you seem to think that they have inbuilt stim and concussive shells, the reality is you’re not factoring your own upgrades for your own units. That’s like QQing that a 3/3 unit can kill your 0/0 unit.
If you have a good mix of sentries, stalkers and zealots kiting becomes impossible, splitting their army is easy and you can’t really take micro into account when saying that a unit is overpowered, i mean of course the top terran in the world with impeccable micro can beat a a-moving toss.
DT’s are actually broken as hell too, perma cloak, no invis base damage of 45. They do the highest dps in the game.
my upgrades also cost a lot more than you. concussive and stim cost a whopping total of 150/150. thats the cost of blink. i have three sets of general upgrades as well. and guess what, they cost more. not only does the marauder have a RIDICULOUSLY high dps/mineral cost, it’s cheaper to upgrade. go figure.
also. not one of your 1,2, or 4 statements makes any logical sense.
1. a containment allows your opponent map control and the ability to expand and macro, and therefor outproduce you. therein lies the terran advantage on LT
2. colossi are good. but really only rape people who allow them to just sit there and shoot. critical mass works well against marine builds. but is like 6 colossi for marauders and that takes 2 bases and a long time.
did you know 2 marauders stimmed do more damage than an immortal? oh and once again, cost less than half as much. and move faster. and slow attacked units.
4. dt’s are the biggest toss all in in the game.10 minutes of tech with the only transition being high templars? which need gateway support when you’ve invested your economy into incredibly expensive dt tech.
The sad truth that many players realize is that comparing T1 combination from all races, Terran’s combo will ‘a-move face-roll’ everything in their path, especially coupled with stim + conc.
I’ve tried it in many different battle situations. Zeals+Stalkers with equal food amounts will get torn apart by M&M, unless they have a ridiculously good terrain advantage, same goes with roach/lings. (And I’ve honestly not seen a lot of zerg actually go roach/ling).
Of course, with correct use of sentries (for toss) and banelings (for zerg), you can easily faceroll their precious m&m army. But sentries require a quick finger and decision making on where to use your FF’s and GS, while banelings need good positioning or run the risk of having them stim and kiting your banelings to hell. (Keep in mind we’re talking about T1 match ups, so no rollie-pollies for you)
The reason we see the complaint of M&M being so powerful is that, yes, they are powerful especially with stim. They require minimal micro to actually destroy similar-food armies (but with micro you can just /lol at the opponent) Needless to say, sub-gold level players will probably see that a-moving with their zealot-stalker army (with zealots getting trapped behind) will shortly see that the terran army will turn theirs into goo.
TLDR; M&M is the best T1 combination in the game, with the exception of effective sentry usage and good baneling play. It WILL rape zeal/stalks and ling/roach.
Starcraft is one of the most balanced games ever made, so the Terran are not weaker. If you talk to the average SC player, non-pro, most will tell you that the Terran are the hardest to master, but they are not the weakest.
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Journal américain surnommé Blanche-Neige était l’agression sexuelle à provoquer l’indignation éditeur contraint à la démission
Journal étudiant de l’Université de Boston, \la liberté Quotidien» a publié récemment un des sept nains de Blanche-Neige agression sexuelle \farce un poisson d’avril signalé, l’indignation provoquée, le rédacteur en chef cette fin a été contraint de démissionner.
GHD
«La liberté Quotidien\ est un journal indépendant, n’est pas soumis à la gestion de l’Université de Boston. Le journal a publié une édition spéciale de \Poisson d’avril\ un rapport espiègle, appelé «Sept Nains arrêtés sur l’agression sexuelle d’une fille nommée Blanche-Neige», provoquant la colère de nombreux lecteurs. Un étudiant dans une interview, dit avec colère: «cette blague n’est pas drôle, et il n’ya aucune raison.\
Lisseur Ghd
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